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“We need to figure out how we go into conversations not looking for the victory, but the progress,” says world debate champion Julia Dhar. In this practical talk, she shares three essential features of productive disagreements grounded in curiosity and purpose. The end result? Constructive conversations that sharpen your argument and strengthen your relationships.
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Transcriber:
Three planes, 25 hours, 10,000 miles.
My dad gets off a flight from Australia
with one thing in mind
and it’s not a snack or a shower or a nap.
It’s November 2016
and Dad is here to talk to Americans
about the election.
Now, Dad’s a news fiend, but for him,
this is not just red or blue,
swing states or party platforms.
He has some really specific intentions.
He wants to listen,
be heard and understand.
And over two weeks,
he has hundreds of conversations
with Americans from
New Hampshire to Miami.
Some of them are tough conversations,
complete differences of opinions,
wildly different worldviews,
radically opposite life experiences.
But in all of those interactions,
Dad walks away
with a big smile on his face
and so does the other person.
You can see one of them here.
And in those interactions,
he’s having a version
of what it seems like we have less of,
but want more of —
a constructive conversation.
We have more ways than ever to connect.
And yet, politically, ideologically,
it feels like we are further
and further apart.
We tell pollsters that we want
politicians who are open-minded.
And yet when they change
their point of view,
we say that they lacked conviction.
For us, when we’re confronted
with information
that challenges an existing worldview,
our tendency is not to open up,
it’s to double down.
We even have a term for it
in social psychology.
It’s called belief perseverance.
And boy, do some people’s beliefs
seem to persevere.
I’m no stranger to tough conversations.
I got my start in what I now call
productive disagreement
in high school debate.
I even went on to win
the World Schools Debate
Championship three times.
I’ve been in a lot of arguments,
is what I’m saying,
but it took watching my dad
on the streets of the US
to understand
that we need to figure out
how we go into conversations.
Not looking for the victory,
but the progress.
And so since November 2016,
that’s what I’ve been doing.
Working with governments,
foundations, corporations, families,
to uncover the tools and techniques
that allow us to talk when it feels
like the divide is unbridgeable.
And constructive conversations
that really move the dialogue forward
have these same three essential features.
First, at least one party
in the conversation
is willing to choose curiosity over clash.
They’re open to the idea
that the discussion is a climbing wall,
not a cage fight,
that they’ll make progress over time
and are able to anchor all of that
in purpose of the discussion.
For someone trained in formal debate,
it is so tempting to run headlong
at the disagreement.
In fact, we call that clash
and in formal argumentation,
it’s a punishable offense
if there’s not enough of it.
But I’ve noticed,
you’ve probably noticed, too,
that in real life that tends
to make people shut down,
not just from the conversation,
but even from the relationship.
It’s actually one of the causes
of unfriending, online and off.
So instead, you might consider a technique
made popular by the Hollywood
producer Brian Grazer,
the curiosity conversation.
And the whole point
of a curiosity conversation
is to understand
the other person’s perspective,
to see what’s on their side of the fence.
And so the next time
that someone says something
you instinctively disagree with,
that you react violently to,
you only need one sentence
and one question:
“I never thought about it
exactly that way before.
What can you share
that would help me see what you see?”
What’s remarkable
about curiosity conversations
is that the people you are curious about
tend to become curious about you.
Whether it’s a friendly
Australian gentleman,
a political foe or a corporate rival,
they begin to wonder
what it is that you see
and whether they could see it to.
Constructive conversations
aren’t a one-shot deal.
If you go into an encounter
expecting everyone to walk out
with the same point of view
that you walked in with,
there’s really no chance for progress.
Instead, we need to think
about conversations as a climbing wall
to do a variant of what
my dad did during this trip,
pocketing a little nugget
of information here,
adapting his approach there.
That’s actually a technique
borrowed from formal debate
where you present an idea,
it’s attacked and you adapt
and re-explain,
it’s attacked again,
you adapt and re-explain.
The whole expectation
is that your idea gets better
through challenge and criticism.
And the evidence from really high-stakes
international negotiations
suggests that that’s what successful
negotiators do as well.
They go into conversations
expecting to learn from the challenges
that they will receive
to use objections to make their ideas
and proposals better.
Development is in some way a service
that we can do for others
and that others can do for us.
It makes the ideas sharper,
but the relationships warmer.
Curiosity can be relationship magic
and development can be
rocket fuel for your ideas.
But there are some situations
where it just feels
like it’s not worth the bother.
And in those cases
it can be because the purpose
of the discussion isn’t clear.
I think back to how my dad
went into those conversations
with a really clear sense of purpose.
He was there to learn, to listen,
to share his point of view.
And once that purpose
is understood by both parties,
then you can begin to move on.
Lay out our vision for the future.
Make a decision.
Get funding.
Then you can move on to principles.
When people shared with my dad
their hopes for America,
that’s where they started
with the big picture,
not with personality
or politics or policies.
Because inadvertently
they were doing something
that we do naturally with outsiders
and find it really difficult sometimes
to do with insiders.
They painted in broad strokes
before digging into the details.
But maybe you live in the same
zip code or the same house
and it feels like none
of that common ground is there today.
Then you might consider a version
of disagreement time travel,
asking your counterpart to articulate
what kind of neighborhood, country,
world, community,
they want a year from now,
a decade from now.
It is very tempting
to dwell in present tensions
and get bogged down in practicalities.
Inviting people to inhabit
a future possibility
opens up the chance
of a conversation with purpose.
Earlier in my career,
I worked for the deputy
prime minister of New Zealand
who practiced a version of this technique.
New Zealand’s electoral system
is designed for unlikely friendships,
coalitions, alliances,
memoranda of understanding
are almost inevitable.
And this particular government set-up
had some of almost everything —
small government conservatives, liberals,
the Indigenous people’s party,
the Green Party.
And I recently asked him,
what does it take to bring
a group like that together
but hold them together?
He said, “Someone, you,
has to take responsibility
for reminding them
of their shared purpose:
caring for people.”
If we are more focused
on what makes us different than the same,
then every debate is a fight.
If we put our challenges
and our problems before us,
then every potential ally
becomes an adversary.
But as my dad packed his bags
for the three flights, 25 hours,
10,000 miles back to Australia,
he was also packing a collection
of new perspectives,
a new way of navigating conversations,
and a whole set of new stories
and experiences to share.
But he was also leaving those behind
with everyone that he’d interacted with.
We love unlikely friendships
when they look like this.
We’ve just forgotten how to make them.
And amid the cacophony of cable news
and the awkwardness of family dinners,
and the hostility of corporate meetings,
each of us has this —
the opportunity
to walk into every encounter,
like my dad walked off that plane,
to choose curiosity over clash,
to expect development
of your ideas through discussion
and to anchor in common purpose.
That’s what really
world-class persuaders do
to build constructive conversations
and move them forward.
It’s how our world will move forward too.
Thank you.
svnelvn
April 9, 2021 at 6:08 am
Damn, she’s smart and beautiful
FLEXCOPE INC.
April 9, 2021 at 6:25 am
Listen more. And shut up when asked.
Black Flame
April 9, 2021 at 7:02 am
I have convos with my coworkers all the time about politics, religion, spirituality, race and gender issues, etc. I’ve learned to listen to them and try to move the conversations in a productive way, by challenging why they believe that way and what experiences led to their eventual conclusion. Often times we both realize we are unequipped with the right data points to make certain conclusions. Even then, there will be times when one party does not budge on their belief even when the adequate facts and logic is presented to them. They don’t want their reality shattered. Human emotion is tricky to circumvent. Even logic and facts don’t change the way people want to believe certain things.
Alias
April 9, 2021 at 8:20 am
No political or religious conversations. Just stick to shallow things like the weather.
fpwu
April 9, 2021 at 8:53 am
Sounds great! Now, if you seek and find progress in a conversation, and the other side on that same occasion seeks, finds and exerts victory – and enjoys the benefits, to your disadvantage… From a broader perspective: Is that progress?
Darker Twelve
April 9, 2021 at 9:01 am
go back to kitchen
abc
April 9, 2021 at 9:39 am
Twitter users need to see this
EighteenXVIII
April 9, 2021 at 9:45 am
Cathy Newman needs to watch this
ファーリアイ・ヌル・
April 9, 2021 at 9:50 am
Mostly it’s not a conversation, more like an argument. People just wanted to win the argument but not to find the common ground.
Operative This is the way
April 9, 2021 at 11:47 am
I can see this lady’s husband losing every argument with her.
micger
April 9, 2021 at 12:00 pm
amazing! Marry me?
Lost Avatar
April 9, 2021 at 12:20 pm
Awesome speach and it should be used against the cancel culture and censorship ideologies currently taking centre stage.
NVG 2022
April 9, 2021 at 12:40 pm
she so pretty
Niel Malan
April 9, 2021 at 12:48 pm
Teaching traditional debating techniques in school is practically child abuse.
Will Budic
April 9, 2021 at 4:43 pm
Don’t get an dual lipa from NATO
They are arseholes in XANADU,
don’t care for US, AU or UK, and Norther Ireland
Xanadu | Olivia Newton-John & Gene Kelly’s ’80s/’40s Hybrid E.L.O. Roller Disco
Leo M
April 9, 2021 at 4:57 pm
{ destruct, variables } = construct ?? conversations
Screamifyoumeanit
April 9, 2021 at 6:27 pm
That’s quite lovely…
Ilya Shmakov
April 10, 2021 at 2:08 am
Given the results of 2016 elections, the technique didn’t really work well for her dad…
Jones BBQ & Footmassage
April 10, 2021 at 2:45 am
Can we just say, how cute she is
Fish Bangla TV
April 10, 2021 at 9:15 am
Beautiful Content
Top of the World
April 10, 2021 at 1:06 pm
Her words are as beautiful as her looks.
crypto Hulk
April 11, 2021 at 2:37 am
~i ~n~ v~ e~ s~ ~t~ i~n~ B~T~C ~$~ ~E~T~H~~
~~W~~h~~a~~~~s~~a~~p~~p~~
+~4~4 ~7~8~6~8~6~9~0~1~0~5
Smi Co
April 10, 2021 at 2:20 pm
This was kind of weird to watch…she looks like 28 and sounds like 52
Henrik J
April 12, 2021 at 10:21 am
We do exist. 28 myself. We usually feel that we have too much insight and knowledge for our age, but try to make the best of it. Completely understand if it feels weird. Just curious, did you think that it made it difficult to consider the message of the talk?
Mykhailo Vasylenko
April 10, 2021 at 3:35 pm
I can barely concentrate on the information she is saying because of her beauty.
Joseph Jay Barrera
April 11, 2021 at 5:32 am
Yes! haha me too!!!!!
Michael Epstein
April 10, 2021 at 7:14 pm
Step 1: Be a Human Being.
Michael Epstein
April 10, 2021 at 7:14 pm
To be Human does not take time.
It is not of time. It is not the result of time or the things of time.
It is not the result of any process.
It is not the result of any method, ritual, or diet.
It is not the result of any chemical.
There is no path to it.
It happens effortlessly and choicelessly…faster than the speed of light.
Moreover, it is once and for all, now and forever.
Michael Epstein
April 10, 2021 at 7:15 pm
i created Jacob’s Ladder to help people be Human. Takes less than 90 minutes.
kibrekidusan mequanint
April 10, 2021 at 8:56 pm
It’s so damn good
Sandra Barbs
April 11, 2021 at 2:30 am
Investing in crypto is the only big chance of making money. For real crypto is profitable. Crypto is the new gold
Sarah jack
April 11, 2021 at 2:32 am
I wanted to trade Crypto but got confused by the fluctuations in price
RUSCA TV
April 11, 2021 at 5:19 am
O seven gönlüne kurban olayım
Yaha
April 11, 2021 at 10:41 am
True..The true spirit of conversation consists in building another man’s observation
LaShawn
April 11, 2021 at 6:40 pm
Checking in from the DMV
Andre Alforque
April 11, 2021 at 11:17 pm
Unlikely friendships: Jon Stewart and John McCain (when he was The Maverick).
BluryFace
April 12, 2021 at 3:59 am
your tongue is yellow !
Gerald Miller
April 12, 2021 at 9:01 am
Antifa physically attacks anyone voicing a different opinion.
Henrik J
April 12, 2021 at 10:15 am
Amazing talk and advice that cannot be given too many times! Thank you!
Jacky
April 12, 2021 at 11:18 am
1. Curiosity over clash – “I never thought about it like that before”
2. Your ideas become better through challenge
Craig Merkey
April 12, 2021 at 6:01 pm
We all know those friends and family members who understand the difference b/t compliance and conversation during communication! Relationship building versus winning!
God Bear
April 12, 2021 at 10:49 pm
This approach isn’t always possible though if the debate is about human rights there is no middle ground. Trying to reach the middle ground on human rights led to such things as Three-Fifths compromise separate but equal and “states rights”
Reena Madian
April 13, 2021 at 11:18 am
Whole idea gets better through challenge & criticism!!
Buddy
April 13, 2021 at 1:49 pm
Listen, be heard, and understand…
Ricardo Hernandez
April 13, 2021 at 4:09 pm
Isn’t this topic known as emotional inteligence? Or maybe is a combination of that and common sense? In this competitive world an enjoyable conversation seems to be labeled as a useless waste of time.
alejandro andres
April 15, 2021 at 11:50 am
life is empty and meaningless until you see a possibility
Rallon Wolfheart
April 15, 2021 at 7:43 pm
Sounds a bit like Street Epistemology
tinkerball vg
May 2, 2021 at 12:44 am
I am so focused on your jaw line.
Chuck Finley
May 3, 2021 at 12:05 pm
There is no conversation at all when the other party simply makes law with the stroke of a pen! Any chance of debate is then null and void!
Aniekan Abasiekong
May 3, 2021 at 6:39 pm
Quite an interesting perspective to look at conversations. Curiosity over clash is a huge point.
Gabrielle S
May 3, 2021 at 7:24 pm
I really like your openings. “I never thought about it like that before” Etc. It puts most of the responsibility on the other person, which in my case is probably good because I tend to recoil
Arsalan Khan
May 4, 2021 at 1:48 pm
Imagine watching a video on how to communicate with your specie.
MD TALKIES
May 5, 2021 at 5:05 pm
👍
Syafira Nasution
May 6, 2021 at 4:59 am
I know I need thia
dlanska
May 8, 2021 at 10:26 am
Absolutely wonderful. Thank you.
Bud Stoney
May 8, 2021 at 11:59 pm
She’s gorgeous 😍
gingnose
May 26, 2021 at 12:17 pm
This was a stunning speech honestly. People often overlook at this point of constructive conversation.
Gautham Nanda Kishore
June 1, 2021 at 10:43 pm
THe USA is imperialistic. period
Gary Rafiq
June 14, 2021 at 1:32 am
And what does your comment have to do with the speech?
etienne kruger
June 2, 2021 at 8:26 am
Someone ate a yellow lollipop before the video
Герман Петров
June 2, 2021 at 3:27 pm
gooood
G A D
June 3, 2021 at 10:02 am
Mandando você e todos pro inferno…. Demônios
Fabián Zambrano
June 6, 2021 at 2:57 pm
I would like if the subtitles were in Spanish, please.
Gary Rafiq
June 14, 2021 at 1:31 am
Click on the gear icon on the lower right and then click on subtitle/CC and then click on Auto-translate which will give you a list of languages to choose from. Bear in mind that the translation may not be accurate.
Cabdi casiis C raxman
June 7, 2021 at 5:52 am
Good
Gaurav Sawant
June 7, 2021 at 3:06 pm
It was a very good Talk and a stimulus, prompting me to have a convo(constructive) with my Ex
Riya Zawar
June 8, 2021 at 4:48 pm
I’ll try to keep that in mind “choose curiosity over clash” and many more things she said. It was a helpful video because my antisocial self really struggles with conversations because of some of my ideals.
Srijan Varma
June 9, 2021 at 9:44 pm
I never thought about it exactly that way before, what can you share that will help me see what you see
That Wierd Kid
June 11, 2021 at 12:42 am
i have tried this and it is helpful but some people omg…jus dont want to be flexible what they think is the truth and shall never be changed no matter how much u try to understand them and u eventually will u will accept it but they will in no world will accept ur ideology
at that point i jus give up… its a waste to even debate with those ppl who put their feelings over logic
eyes2eyes
June 12, 2021 at 12:30 pm
Simple but really valuable ted talk
M. Rizkiawan Latif
June 14, 2021 at 7:45 am
Gorgeous woman, genius yet beautiful
Tumisho
June 15, 2021 at 5:54 pm
Revolutionary
Mohammed Ali
June 17, 2021 at 6:18 am
Beautiful 🥴🥀❤
中华有为
June 17, 2021 at 1:09 pm
不会英语，不知道在说什么